LEADERSHIP & CONVERSATION

In this episode of the Wealth & Purpose Podcast, Brady Fineske speaks with Dr. Rick Eigenbrod, author of What Happens When You Get What You Want and co-author of the Yale case study What's Next? The Entrepreneur's Epilogue and the Paradox of Success. Dr. Eigenbrod shares what actually happens after achieving significant success — not the theory, but the lived reality experienced by entrepreneurs, executives, and high achievers who reach the finish line only to find it isn't what they imagined. The conversation explores why so many successful people feel lost, adrift, and unprepared after selling a business or reaching a major life milestone, and what it takes to rediscover structure, meaning, and identity on the other side of success. Dr. Eigenbrod emphasizes the importance of understanding who you are now, what truly matters to you, and how to follow the small signals of vitality that point toward a more fulfilling next chapter. Key points from this episode: - Why achieving a significant goal can come with unexpected loss, and why so few people are prepared for it - How the disruption to structure, meaning, and identity creates the "paradox of success" - Why the tools that made you successful can actually work against you in this next phase of life - The focusing illusion — and why our picture of "happily ever after" leaves out everything that matters - Why "purpose" can feel overwhelming, and the simpler question to ask instead - How to follow the vitality — the small inklings that point toward your next chapter - Resources, programs, and books to help navigate life after the exit Chapters: 0:00 - The Dark Side of Success 1:46 - The Wall Street Journal Ad 8:44 - Why No One Is Prepared 12:52 - What You Actually Bought 16:57 - What Money Can't Replace 28:43 - The Lie We All Believe 34:05 - When Success Works Against You 41:10 - Stop Searching for Purpose 46:55 - Why Winning Isn't Enough 50:25 - The Signal to Follow Interested in a copy of Rick’s book “What Happens When You Get What You Want: Success and the Challenge of Choice”? Subscribe and complete our form: https://tdcforms.wufoo.com/forms/get-a-copy-of-dr-rick-eigenbrods-book/ Connect with TFO Wealth Partners: https://tfowealth.com/ LinkedIn: Brady Fineske, CFP®: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bradyfineske LinkedIn: TFO Wealth Partners: https://www.linkedin.com/company/tfowealth Facebook: TFO Wealth Partners: https://www.facebook.com/tfowealth/ Instagram: TFO Wealth Partners: https://www.instagram.com/tfowealthpartners/ X: TFO Wealth Partners: https://x.com/tfowealth About Our Guest, Dr. Rick Eigenbrod: Dr. Rick Eigenbrod is an experienced Executive Coach, Organizational Development Consultant, and author of What Happens When You Get What You Want. His work centers on helping leaders and high achievers navigate growth, transition, and performance through innovative approaches to leadership development and change management. He is also co-author of the Yale case study What's Next? The Entrepreneur's Epilogue and the Paradox of Success. He has led change management and performance projects for organizations including AT&T, Google, United HealthCare, and the Hewlett Foundation, and has served as a featured Resource Speaker for more than 500 Vistage groups nationwide, earning the distinction of USA Speaker of the Year for Vistage Canada. Rick holds a Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology from Michigan State University, an M.A. from Auburn University, and a B.A. from Tulane University. TFO Wealth Partners, LLC ("TFO") is an SEC-registered investment advisor located in Maumee, OH. Brady Fineske is a Partner and investment adviser representative of TFO. Registration with the SEC does not imply a certain level of skill or training. The opinions expressed in this podcast are for general informational and educational purposes only, are subject to change at any time, and should not be construed as TFO's or Mr. Fineske's solicitation to effect, or attempt to effect, transactions in securities, or the rendering of personalized investment advice. All investments and strategies, including any described in this podcast, have the potential for profit or loss. Past performance does not guarantee future results. Any index performance described in this broadcast does not reflect the deduction of transaction, management, or other fees that would decrease performance results. While the information presented in this podcast is believed to be factual and up to date, TFO or Mr. Fineske does not guarantee its accuracy, and it should not be regarded as a complete analysis of the subjects discussed. Listeners should not rely on the content of this podcast as the sole basis for their legal, tax, investment, financial planning or estate planning decisions and should always consult an attorney or tax professional or any other investment professional regarding what may be appropriate for their specific situations. 534aWP - 2026.05

In this episode, you'll experience a deep-dive exploration into the aftermath of success in this riveting conversation with clinical psychologist and Vistage International Chair, Rick Eigenbrod. You’ll hear about the hidden challenges and implications of achieving your dreams - what happens when you finally get what you want? Rick's insightful book, "What Happens When You Get What You Want", serves as a guide as we navigate the complexities of achieving what we desire. Mike and Rick discuss the concept of "bundling" - the search for fulfillment beyond financial gain and the misconception that wealth equates to happiness. Rick and Mike share personal stories and examples showcasing the significant role of personal fulfillment in defining success. They go beyond the dollars and cents, illustrating the challenges and complexities that come with sudden wealth. They also discuss life after selling a business and the courage it takes to venture into something new. Finally, Rick challenges the societal narrative that equates success with material possessions and status. It's time we redefine success and acknowledge the journey that continues beyond the attainment of a goal. This episode wraps up with a call to live in the moment, breaking free from the illusion of a perfect future. This discussion promises to shift your perspective, offering a fresh look at success and what comes after. So, are you ready to redefine success? Tune in! Connect with Rick Eigenbrod: Website: rickeigenbrod.com Get Rick’s book: What Happens When You Get What You Want: https://www.amazon.com/What-Happens-When-You-Want/dp/0990021939 To Connect with Mike Malatesta: Website: https://mikemalatesta.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikemalatesta/ Get Mike’s book “Owner Shift”: https://mikemalatesta.com/owner-shift-book-by-mike-malatesta/

For more post-exit wisdom go to https://www.exitparadox.com and subscribe to https://www.youtube.com/@ExitParadoxPodcast. 🚀 Rick Eigenbrod is a deeply respected thinker in the post-exit world. A clinical psychologist and co-author of the classic Yale paper What’s Next: The Entrepreneur’s Epilogue, he’s spent years guiding founders through life after the exit as an executive coach. In this conversation, we get into why Rick believes a “death of who we used to be” and a subsequent "re-birth" are inevitable post-exit, and how resisting these changes only adds to the struggle. We also explore the grip of dopamine addiction, the healing power of legitimizing post-success frustration, simple ways to reconnect with our natural curiosity and playfulness, and the bittersweet reality of leaving some people behind as we experience exponential personal growth. 00:00:21: The paradox of success 00:00:43: Rick's background and contributions 00:01:12: Exploring dopamine addiction and post-success frustrations 00:02:04: Introduction to the "What's Next?" paper 00:02:45: Rick's background and experience with exited founders 00:03:52: How Rick came to the subject of post-exit issues 00:04:47: Rick's critical event with Vistage group 00:07:21: The paradox: ending or beginning 00:07:52: Reflections on the dual meaning of success 00:08:53: Grappling with post-exit paradox 00:09:41: The "focusing illusion" and the arrival fallacy 00:11:12: The societal pressure to be happy post-exit 00:12:01: Support groups and legitimating experiences 00:13:08: Initial reactions and reflections on the post-exit reality 00:14:31: The societal issue of ignoring exited founders 00:15:33: The lack of support and self-blame post-exit 00:19:07: Dealing with loss of motivation 00:20:38: The challenge of striving without a company 00:22:21: Stories of loss of identity and success paradox 00:23:02: The impact on identity and structure post-exit 00:24:29: Avoiding the inclination to fill the void with the same elements 00:25:01: Personal experiences of changing motivations 00:25:32: Closing the first business 00:25:53: Importance of creating space 00:26:18: Question of true desires and freedom paradox 00:27:06: Indecision paralysis and self-discovery 00:33:16: Financial dangers post-exit 00:34:53: Common failures in second businesses 00:35:30: Paradox of money and its role 00:41:03: Refusal of the call and negative transfer of learning 00:44:10: Dopamine addiction as an obstacle 00:47:00: Fear of losing entrepreneurial identity 00:51:13: Leaving people behind during personal growth 00:56:03: Advising young successful entrepreneurs 00:57:23: Identifying and addressing emotional struggles post-sale 00:57:50: Experimenting with the notion of changing scale 01:03:34: Evaluating motivations before starting a new business 01:05:00: Listening for truth, vitality, and fear in decisions 01:07:32: Distinguishing between legitimate fears and psychological barriers 01:14:00: The search for meaning and what matters now 01:16:22: Two ways of knowing and going: Destination vs Direction 01:17:57: Understanding fulfillment and satisfaction 01:21:00: Stories about finding fulfillment 01:23:06: Wrapping up the conversation 01:23:26: Legacy question 01:24:00: Discussion about dynamics of arrival 01:27:00: The role of intention in satisfaction 01:29:19: Closing remarks and future plans 🔗 CONNECT WITH RICK: 💻 Website - https://www.rickeigenbrod.com/ 🔗 CONNECT WITH ANASTASIA: 🎥 YouTube Channel - https://www.youtube.com/@ExitParadoxPodcast 🐦 X (Twitter) - https://x.com/AnasKoroleva 📸 Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/anastasiashoot 💻 Website - https://www.exitparadox.com 🗞️ Newsletter - https://www.exitparadox.com/blog 👥 Linkedin - https://www.linkedin.com/in/anastasiakoroleva TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@anastasia.korolev7 📄SHOW NOTES & TRANSCRIPT - https://www.exitparadox.com/podcast/rick-eigenbrod 🎙 ABOUT THE PODCAST Exit Paradox explores the journeys of the world's most remarkable post-exit founders to uncover the insights, strategies, and tools to help us live happier, healthier, and more fulfilling lives after business success. 🎧 LISTEN FOR FREE Apple Podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/rick-eigenbrod-post-exit-death-is-inevitable/id1719806072?i=1000676880591 Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/episode/2wCtyeM7vbFY0hqm3KU8JZ 🙏 LEAVE A REVIEW If you enjoyed listening to the podcast, we'd love for you to leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts to help others discover the show :) https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/exit-paradox/id1719806072 👋🏼 GET IN TOUCH You can also Tweet https://x.com/AnasKoroleva or LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/anastasiakoroleva with any feedback, ideas or thoughts about the lessons you've learnt from the episodes and we can thank you personally for tuning in 🙏 “Post-Exit Death is Inevitable”

Your senior leaders know they're supposed to be strategic. They've said it in the room. You've said it. Everyone agrees. And then pressure hits, and they drop right back into the operational weeds, and you find yourself asking: how do I get them to stay strategic? That question is the problem. In this episode, David Wheatley sits down with Dr. Rick Eigenbrod and Dr. Judy Brown to dig into what's actually happening when C-suite and senior leadership teams can't hold altitude. Rick opens with something that stops leaders cold: the moment you ask "how do I get them to," you've already created a dependency relationship that guarantees they won't take ownership. The real questions are different ones, and this conversation surfaces all of them. They get into why teams regress under pressure, what the Air Florida crash reveals about rank and suppressed information, how your own anxiety as a leader may be driving the exact behavior you're frustrated by, and whether the people you're asking to operate strategically are actually developmentally capable of doing so. The school district example midway through is worth the whole episode. Topics covered include the altitude chart framework, Kegan's developmental stages, the Wisdom of Teams distinction between teams and work groups, the role of metrics and reward systems in pulling people tactical, and the "produce, create, and be" exercise for getting real clarity on what a team actually exists to do. David, Rick, and Judy are part of the Humanergy leadership development practice, where the work is grounded in real organizations facing real problems, not frameworks in search of a use case. Watch, sit with it, and share it with someone who's been asking the same question.

What if your team’s “people problems” are actually design problems? In this episode, David Wheatley is joined by Dr. Judy Brown and Dr. Rick Eigenbrod to explore a leadership question that doesn’t get asked enough, how much of team performance comes down to structure, not personalities. You’ll hear why collaboration may be more natural than we think, how organizations accidentally get in the way of it, and what leaders can redesign to create real flow, clarity, and shared ownership, without forcing it. Topics include: Why structure can trump culture, strategy, and good intentions “Roundabouts vs stoplights,” a simple analogy for healthier systems Who gets in the room, and why one wrong seat can stall the whole team Boundary conditions, meeting design, and business literacy across leaders Reward systems, accountability, and the difference between ownership and compliance The inner work, maturity, ego, and what it takes to lead for the greater good Want to explore more tools like What Great Teams Do Great, join Humanergy’s Free Workshop Zoom session, held every month at noon Eastern, details at humanergy.com.

David Wheatley, Judy Brown, and Rick Eigenbrod discuss the challenges of leadership in times of turbulence, emphasizing the need for new approaches. They highlight the concept of "BANI" (Brittle, Anxious, Non-linear, Incomprehensible) as a replacement for VUCA, noting the familiarity and ineffectiveness of traditional terms. The conversation underscores the importance of leaders adapting to rapid change, fostering reflection and conversation as actionable steps, and encouraging a shift from seeking clarity to seeing things differently. They also explore the impact of AI on leadership, suggesting it should enhance human capabilities rather than replace them. Learn more about Humanergy's work: https://www.humanergy.com Sign up for our FREE leadership workshops: https://humanergy.com/first-fridays/

David is joined by Judy Brown and Rick Eigenbrod to build on Dr. Martin Luther King's letter from a Birmingham jail - and to ask what is the letter that only you can write? At the heart of the chat we ask what do you have to say to the world and challenge you to think about what you don't think about

David talks with Judy Brown and Rick Eigenbrod about how we can make good decisions about the health and welfare of our leaders. They delve into how loneliness is the emotion of isolation and how leaders can kick off their teams with some words to limit their isolation. There is a great article we found after recording that mirrors the sentiment... Give your boss a break: See the human behind the role by Kevin Kruse

David and Judy Brown talk about an experience they had where a jazz band was the keynote speaker at a quality conference and the leadership lessons that were drawn from the event